Quote:
Originally Posted by scg87
Nope, YOU are wrong, AGAIN-
The I only weight listing I found for an S197 GT was 3,523, but we won't quiblle over it. So let's just say the GT has a 200lb weight advantage. A supercharger kit does NOT add 100lbs to the car. More like 50lbs. So the Mustang would still have a 150~ pound advantage. I mistakenly put whp instead of crank hp earlier, and that's what I meant. The most conservative supercharger setups for the S197 put them around 415hp w/ a very mild tune, and no other supporting mods. If you don't think a 415hp S197 will light an LS2 GTO up, you're crazy. Not only will it have a horsepower advantage, it's torque curve (what REALLY matters) would put the GTO's to shame. Factor in how much better the Mustang launches w/ it's solid-axle rear, and it's game over for the Goat, unless terrible driving skills come into play.
And you're also wrong about the Roush. Not that that's surprising. The Roush 427R has been tested out of the box to 12.30's, enough to blow your piddly Vette and an LS2 GTO both out of the water. 13.30's w/ that car is awful. 100% stock to the tire S197 GT's have gone 13.30's. That guy either sucked at driving, or his time was subject to some terrible track conditions. But considering he only beat your car by less than a .1, he must have sucked.
And again, even a GT w/ the 415~hp dealer installed blower kit is going to put a GTO down. Lighter weight, better suspension for launching, and a much better power curve. To think otherwise is just denial. But then again, you leg humping GM guys seem to take that pretty well.....
I should stick to the Nissan forums??? Really??? Because I own a Nissan right??? Oh, wait, no I don't, that was just another lame-ass attempt to get off a pop-shot insult in true Fergy fashion. Maybe you should stick to the Corvette forums seeing as in how it's the greatest advent of the automotive world, and how their owners seem to have the same stuck up mentality as you.
Oh, and since you just love magazine racing so much, allow me to enlighten you-
Ford Shelby GT500 Track Testing - Muscle Mustangs & Fast Fords Magazine
Yeah, so much for those 12.8- 13.1 road tests. And in another test, a completely stock one went 12.257 at 117.180 mph. The ones you see are being piloted br some nad drivers apparently.
Secondly, LT's car is nowhere near faster than a GT500 Vert by .7 secs. Stock C5 Z06's are low 12's on average. His car has the added hindrance of being a Vert, having crappier tires, and most importantly, worse gearing. So he MIGHT be a 12.50-12.60 car. Maybe. If he's a good driver. Factor in a few extra tenths for the GT500 being a Vert, and if he's a good driver, 12.60's should be entirely possible. So equal drivers, the two cars times would be a toss up. By no means a .4-.7 advantage for LT's Vette like you suggest. Furhtermore, on a highway roll, the GT500's weight is going to be less of an issue, and it's horsepower advantage will give it the edge.
You wanna talk about me not knowing what I'm talking about, maybe you shold re-evalute your own standings first. You fudge the results by using stats and figures that are biased, and support your claims, which are also biased. And you're doing it solely for the fact that his car is a Corvette. If the cars being discussed had identical numbers, but only differed in car, let's say a GT500 vs modded 350Z (since you love to hate them so much), you'd be all for the GT500, taking it's side, and laying it's praise. As w/ every pissing match you and I get into, it's because you've let your own bias get in the way of making sound decisions based on supported logic and facts.
So maybe you should keep that aforementioned dollar......  |
Again, you need to get out into the real world. ForensicSteve gets to the track and the BEST he has seen is 12.5 from a GT500. You need to understand, that just because MM&FF's hot shoe takes a GT500 and ices down the intake and spends time prepping the track to the exact situation that he wants, doesn't reflect the real world. I've seen several 427R's that ran low to mid 13's. Have you ever been to the track and actually watched cars run on a regular basis. I'm there 2-3 times a month now and was for the better part of the last decade through 2004, at the track twice a week.
I've gotten my GTO to run in the 12's and regularly ran low 13's. I got my C5 Z06 to run 11.501 at 118 mph. I got my LT4 Vette real close to the 12's. I'm also pretty good at watching cars and being able to tell who's good and who's not. From experience. When I tell you the guy driving the Roush I raced was good, you need to either take my word for it or come up with something other than I saw this video or read that magazine to discredit real life experience.
For the Mustang's weight, I've seen 3367, 3531, 3532, 3550, 3555, 3583. I ignored the 3367, the others are all fairly close and that seems more like the weight I've seen for the V6 model. I figured 3350 is right in the middle and selected it. I looked at Voretechs website. I found superchargers listed for 50-80 lbs and I guessed at the weight of the intercooler and plumbing. I then looked at curb weights on supercharged Saleens and Roush cars, nothing was under 3650. I used 100lbs as a safe guess.
I know what the cars are rated at, like was mentioned, you need to look at the power curve of the engines and the gearing, but really that is just bench racing. When the rubber hits the dragstrip anything can happen. And it does, the 427R runs low 13's. That's what Car & Driver got and they even mentioned that now the Mustang can keep up with the GTO.
The Nissan comment was because you are always talking about them. I know you own an A4. I'm back to owning a Cavalier for now. Looks like the snob factor is headed your way. Hey that might be a good race, my Cav versus your A4. That's right you don't head to the track. There another pop-shot. You just make it too easy.
Actually the LT4 beat the Roush, 3 times too, but he did miss a shift on one of the passes. Yeah I know poor quality driver missing a shift. Yada Yada Yada. He cut a less than 2.0 60' and had a reaction time below .100 everytime. Of course your the guy that never gets to the track and could do much better. There I pop-shotted again.
Leg humping GM guys. Well that's the nicest thing you've said about me. Thanks. Does that qualify as a pop-shot??? I'm trying to reach my quota of Fergy pop-shots and it's pretty high today.
Neither you or I know what LTChappa's car will run. I'm guessing 12.5 with his mods. Again, the GT500 might have gotten to 12.257, but that took several tries and several cars by Evan Smith. He's the Mustang Hot shoe, like Ranger is the Corvette Hot shoe. Ranger has hit 11.1 in a stock C6 Z06. So you understand what stock is, I'm talking no DR's, paper air filters, just the way it came from the factory. Would I ever quote the Z06 as being an 11.1 car, nope, 11.5- 11.7 is what the factory and most magazines get. That's the real number, just like 12.8-13.1 is the real number for the GT500. Add 1-2 tenths for the extra weight of the vert and you have a 4-7 tenths victory to LTChappa. Every time. You go ahead and keep taking the worst numbers for the GM products, and the best numbers for anything else. I'll stick to my real world numbers.
You think I'm biased to the Vette, well your off again. I'm the guy that tried to get a guy that had a stock C5 to run my 05 GTO to show him the GTO was faster than a stock C5. I'm the first guy on the Vette forum to tell C5 guys they aren't going to be beating an 03-04 Mustang Cobra without some mods. I criticized the seats, the heat that transfers into the cockpit and made the comment more than a couple times that the GTO was much better on a trip. When things aren't in the Vette, or the GTO's favor I'll point it out and use facts to back it up.
A modded 350Z beating a stock GT500. I wouldn't touch that one. I'm not sure what mods you would need and what type of performance a 350Z has with what mods. I do know a bit about stock Mustangs and modded ones since I owned some and a Contour SVT and was active up till 2004 with SVTOA. I usually tend to side with a modded turbo Supra being extremely fast to the point it's silly. All you seem interested in is pissing on GM and GTO's and Vette's.
You never post anything that is remotely positive about the car this forum is dedicated to. You think S197 Mustangs are 13.3 cars and begrudge saying the GTO is a 13.1-13.2 car. Meanwhile the best GTO stock is, I think 12.7 or definately 12.8, and most Mustangs run 13.8. Let's get real, your on a GTO forum. If you hate the car go away.
