Opening front end up behind grill - Pontiac GTO Forum
User Tag List

 3Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-02-2018, 04:39 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Opening front end up behind grill

Do folks open up an opening behind the grills to let cold air into the engine bay ? While the engine is far from sealed, there clearly is not a great path of cold air to the carbs....Since I am restoring the car and everything is apart, I have been wondering if folks generally make small modifications like this (as is done with so many other cars). If so, do folks have any pictures ?

Also while I have read about the dealer installed factory scoop (ram air), whereby the hood was cut, it appears the bigger challenge is the fake grill. How did the dealer open up the fake grill in the top center of the hood (sorry don't know what to call it)? Thanks

1965 GTO Convertible 3 speed tri-power drum brakes originally

Current setup:
400 cu in with tri-power
4 speed Muncie
cij911 is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-02-2018, 05:55 PM
Super Moderator
 
GTO JUDGE's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Lancaster, PA
Posts: 8,433
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by cij911 View Post
Do folks open up an opening behind the grills to let cold air into the engine bay ? While the engine is far from sealed, there clearly is not a great path of cold air to the carbs....Since I am restoring the car and everything is apart, I have been wondering if folks generally make small modifications like this (as is done with so many other cars). If so, do folks have any pictures ?

Also while I have read about the dealer installed factory scoop (ram air), whereby the hood was cut, it appears the bigger challenge is the fake grill. How did the dealer open up the fake grill in the top center of the hood (sorry don't know what to call it)? Thanks
I have seen some modify their closed scoops using a dremel tool to cut the center area away. As far as an opening behind the grilles, the radiator of my '70 is just behind the grilles, plenty of air running through.

President: GTO Association of America
www.gtoaa.org


GTO JUDGE is offline  
post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-03-2018, 07:53 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO JUDGE View Post
I have seen some modify their closed scoops using a dremel tool to cut the center area away. As far as an opening behind the grilles, the radiator of my '70 is just behind the grilles, plenty of air running through.
Yes but that air is quite a bit hotter than the ambient air (maybe)....My thought was to open a hole up on both side to direct cold air right into the engine bay.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	front left grill.jpg
Views:	74
Size:	77.9 KB
ID:	103041   Click image for larger version

Name:	front right grill.jpg
Views:	56
Size:	44.7 KB
ID:	103049  

1965 GTO Convertible 3 speed tri-power drum brakes originally

Current setup:
400 cu in with tri-power
4 speed Muncie

Last edited by cij911; 02-03-2018 at 09:31 PM.
cij911 is online now  
 
post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-03-2018, 09:38 PM
 
PontiacJim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Gastonia, NC - Born & raised in Connecticut - 31 years
Posts: 3,559
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 365 Post(s)
Garage
"How did the dealer open up the fake grill in the top center of the hood (sorry don't know what to call it)?"

I believe the technical term is "hood insert." The cold air or Ram Air inserts were cast as open, just like the non-RA inserts were cast as closed. So two different factory offerings with regards to the hood inserts.

What is your reasoning & goal in directing outside air into the engine bay? Quite a few offerings on Ebay that might give you some ideas. https://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_saca...per+air+intake
PontiacJim is offline  
post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-04-2018, 07:22 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by PontiacJim View Post
"How did the dealer open up the fake grill in the top center of the hood (sorry don't know what to call it)?"

I believe the technical term is "hood insert." The cold air or Ram Air inserts were cast as open, just like the non-RA inserts were cast as closed. So two different factory offerings with regards to the hood inserts.

What is your reasoning & goal in directing outside air into the engine bay? Quite a few offerings on Ebay that might give you some ideas. https://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_saca...per+air+intake
Jim - Different hood inserts makes sense as it looked too hard to cut cleanly! My thought was that I could make an opening to the right and left of the radiator and cold air would be directed into the engine bay, hopefully reduce IAT a bit, and reduce the chance of pre detonation / increase HP. While cold air intakes are great, I would have to literally run hoses or tubing up to the carbs and have the carbs isolated from the engine bay air (which I won't do), so I guess it is pointless or would yield little benefit.

Back to wrenching on the electrical system and POR15 work. I am installing the MAD Electrical Start Em' Up kit and probably the light and accessory relays as well and almost done with the POR15 on the floors.

1965 GTO Convertible 3 speed tri-power drum brakes originally

Current setup:
400 cu in with tri-power
4 speed Muncie
cij911 is online now  
post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-04-2018, 11:28 AM
 
PontiacJim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Gastonia, NC - Born & raised in Connecticut - 31 years
Posts: 3,559
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 365 Post(s)
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by cij911 View Post
Jim - Different hood inserts makes sense as it looked too hard to cut cleanly! My thought was that I could make an opening to the right and left of the radiator and cold air would be directed into the engine bay, hopefully reduce IAT a bit, and reduce the chance of pre detonation / increase HP. While cold air intakes are great, I would have to literally run hoses or tubing up to the carbs and have the carbs isolated from the engine bay air (which I won't do), so I guess it is pointless or would yield little benefit.

Back to wrenching on the electrical system and POR15 work. I am installing the MAD Electrical Start Em' Up kit and probably the light and accessory relays as well and almost done with the POR15 on the floors.
OK, got it. The "Ram Air" systems used by many makers in various forms were in my opinion a little more than the visual looks and bragging rights. It did help to some extent to bring cooler outside air into the engine, not the engine bay, and this was usually at higher speeds.

As long as the hood is in place, it will trap hot engine temps. Mopars seem to run hot under the hood in my opinion and on my 1973 Fury the factory installed seals (flat 1/4" flexible panels) strategically behind the grille to seal off some of the surrounding open areas and channel/force air flow through the radiator area. I think their nose design with its inner fender panels creates more of a box enclosure that traps more heat than lets say a GM product with its inner fender well design and a bunch more open areas for hot temps to escape.

To keep engine temps down, just run a good cooling system using an aluminum radiator, fan shroud, good fan, and a 160 degree thermostat. Correct carb settings (not too lean) and proper ignition timing are also part of a cool running engine.

Of course there is the "old school" remove the hood completely to show off your engine and chromed accessories or what some racers do, lift the rear of the hood with spacers high enough to create airflow out the back at the windshield.
geeteeohguy, 70Koza and cij911 like this.
PontiacJim is offline  
post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-04-2018, 02:36 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Jim - Interesting I still can't seem to find anyone that sells the open inserts...I would have thought this was a cold air kit (ram air pan + inserts)....Oh well...

1965 GTO Convertible 3 speed tri-power drum brakes originally

Current setup:
400 cu in with tri-power
4 speed Muncie
cij911 is online now  
post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-04-2018, 08:21 PM
 
PontiacJim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Gastonia, NC - Born & raised in Connecticut - 31 years
Posts: 3,559
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 365 Post(s)
Garage
No one sells an open insert as it is easy enough to modify any of the aftermarket closed hood inserts. Fairly simple job with the right tools. If you can't do it yourself, take it to a machine shop and let them do it.

You will also have to cut your under hood bracing as well as the bracing behind the insert.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	01  1965-67 Ram Air hood mods.JPG
Views:	65
Size:	25.6 KB
ID:	103065   Click image for larger version

Name:	02  1965-67 Ram Air hood mods.JPG
Views:	72
Size:	30.2 KB
ID:	103073  
PontiacJim is offline  
post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-05-2018, 08:43 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Ah so buy an aftermarket insert and cut that....smart....thanks Jim (again)....

I'd like to buy you a beer, but have a feeling you are no where close....How about mail you some local micro brews ?

1965 GTO Convertible 3 speed tri-power drum brakes originally

Current setup:
400 cu in with tri-power
4 speed Muncie
cij911 is online now  
post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-05-2018, 12:22 PM
 
1968gto421's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Travelers Rest, South Carolina
Posts: 752
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 70 Post(s)
Ames performance sells an open scoop insert for your '65. Here is the lnk:

https://secure.amesperf.com/qilan/De...A&web_access=Y

Ames also offers the complete inderhood things with the pan and airfilter mods to do a factory ram air setup

http://www.amesperf.com/

Hope all this helps.

Last edited by 1968gto421; 02-05-2018 at 06:52 PM. Reason: spelling
1968gto421 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Pontiac GTO Forum > The 1964-1974 Pontiac Tempest, Lemans & GTO > 1964-1974 Tempest, Lemans & GTO Complete Engine Compartment Discussion

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Pontiac GTO Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Recessed front grill Cole S Exterior Discussions 5 05-31-2013 08:22 AM
assembling the front end busaben 1964-1974 Tempest, LeMans & GTO Projects, Barn Finds & Restoration Discussions 0 02-17-2013 09:22 AM
G8 front end LS6wantabe Exterior Discussions 33 03-26-2010 05:29 PM
Billet grill with SAP front bumper Speedlyte Exterior Discussions 11 03-28-2007 11:19 AM
Front end work GoToIt 1964-1974 Tempest, Lemans & GTO General Discussion 1 11-01-2004 01:22 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome