Preadator programer, how much power are they worth? - Pontiac GTO Forum
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post #1 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-17-2004, 12:02 AM Thread Starter
 
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Preadator programer, how much power are they worth?

I am shooting for 400 hp (flywheel) with the following mods: SLP 1.85 rockers, underdrive pulley, MAF pipe w/K&N filter and shorty headers. Howerver I am seeing considerable comment that the shorties are showing little or no gain over the stock manifolds and that the Predator tuners are supposedly producing 15-20 hp. Sounds like the Predator offers more HP per $. Have any of you had firsthand experience with the Predator (or any of the other programmers) on a lightly modified 04?

Thanks,

Warren

P.S. I have a 6 speed manual trans.

Last edited by wakarr; 11-17-2004 at 12:21 AM.
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post #2 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-17-2004, 03:58 AM
 
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Diablo used to not be so good, well to be nice they sorta sucked , but with this unit I think they may have redeemed themselves. Superchips is another Vendor that comes to mind that used to make some crappy chips out of Florida and have turned it around. They now make a very decent OBDII programmer like Hypertech that works really well.


That being said (or typed),

If it was my money (and it isn't ) I would do as many mods as possible before adding a tuning/ programmer part such as this Diablo one to get the maximum gains from it.

Last edited by MaxHax; 11-17-2004 at 04:00 AM. Reason: typos, I'm stating to think it's this keyboard?
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post #3 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-25-2004, 01:07 AM Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for your input, I think i'll wait for now on a tuner.

Warren
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post #4 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-25-2004, 03:22 AM
 
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No problem, I'm in the same boat and want headers but live in Calif. I had this same issue with my FireHawk and Z28 and ended up going with mid length headers or "mids". They could pass a visual and the tail pipe sniffer. Now I see that there is already one company making a "mid" size type header, in fact I think it is SLP I will have to recheck. Waiting is always good.

Bottom line is any header is gonna flow more than stock even say JBA shorties but if you are going to spend 500 bucks or more on headers plus all the labor involved you might as well go all out and do it right once and get the most gains. Long Tubes will show the most gains if you can address the smog check issue. I am leaning towards mids and waitng to see more options then tuning.
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post #5 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-25-2004, 07:48 PM
 
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I have a predator & I think it was a great investment.
You cant judge this tuner on hp #'s
The major improvement in acceleration & perforrmance are caused by
the removal of the torque managent & the changes in the shifting of
the automatic Tranny. Im not sure if there is torque management on m6 cars.
The engine timing is also updated to run on premium fuel only & this will
yield improvements on m6 cars as well.
The predator lets you use more of the available hp & sends more to the rear wheels. I also had a custom tune from rwtd.com. If you buy it from them you
get lifetime custom tunes for $100. If you do any mods they can adjust your tune. For example I just added the k&N aircharger kit & they adjusted my tune
and the car runs great. The car was running lean after the install & they
adjusted my tune.
You can also go back to the stock tune any time. Which is great for going
back to the dealer & for the yearly inspection.
I hope I was of some help to you .
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post #6 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-25-2004, 08:07 PM
 
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Thanks that link doesn't work for me though rwtd.com.

I bet with my descreened MAF, SLP CAI and SLP exhaust I could show a decent gain with this Tuner if anything I would be in the sweet spot of my A/F and timing and I do have an A4.

I guess I need to move this Mod up towards the top of my want/need GTO list.

Edit add, I love this forum though, I didn't even know we had torque management on this car that explains allot. Does TQ Managent get disabled when you turn off TC?

On my Nissan I had to hardwire a switch from the brake light fuse to turn it off prior to getting my ECU reflashed and it was a real PITA at the track to race with no brake lights and remember to turn that switch on/off all the time!

Last edited by MaxHax; 11-25-2004 at 08:10 PM.
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post #7 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-25-2004, 10:14 PM
 
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We cant turn off the torque managerment.
Does removing the screen on the mass air censor make a noticable difference?
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post #8 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-25-2004, 11:51 PM Thread Starter
 
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Removing the MAF screen can often cause a lean condition resulting in pinging. Better to buy ($40.00 to $80.00) replacement MAF ends that replace the stock pieces, that way you can always return the MAF to original condition if necessary.
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post #9 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-26-2004, 01:07 AM
 
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"Removing the MAF screen can often cause a lean condition resulting in pinging. "

So can allot of things even over heating can cause pinging from a blocked radiator or a tank of bad gas. However in my case it didn't , it added power. This is one of those never ending debates I don't need to be in because I drive this car daily and it runs excellent so I don't need more proof. Every car is different though, some gain a tenth with a $400.00 MAF others lose a tenth. On my car descreening the MAF and adding a CAI made a MAJOR difference. I'm not running FI where adding .3 in my A/F is gonna blow my engine like with my Z. BTW, what would be normal A/F for our cars stock? Around 14.*? I should follow that aspect to prepare for tuning.

Ported MAF ends are a waste of money for LS1's in my opnion unless you can get them used for under 50 bucks, been there done that. My car runs very strong even on 89 octane, never has pinged once, ever. I was broke and ran a whole tank of 89 and never pinged without the screen. Before you mention it I also don't have any KR or detonation. I wonder if this car would fail safe to limp mode?

As for leaning out most cars come pig rich from the factory anyways but that is why I am looking into tuning. Most power is made with these "tuners" via timing and A/F adjustments the TQ Kill sounds like an added bonus plus I'm interseted in the shift firmness too.



Now, why is it being said you can't remove torque management when others say you can?

I did it in my Nissan every day with the flip of the switch, others claim this Predator does it.

Does it or doesn't it? I haven't researched this Diablo peice yet but that would be a nice addition.

Last edited by MaxHax; 11-26-2004 at 01:25 AM. Reason: Error in TB and AIT positioning removed.
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post #10 of 34 (permalink) Old 11-27-2004, 12:02 AM
 
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The Predator comes with a factory performance tune that somewhat lowers the torque management but doesn't eliminate it. James at RWTD will write you a custom tune that will totally eliminate the torque management, change the speed limiter, and make any other modifications to compensate for any mods you may have done. If you purchase the Predator from him for $419, he will modify your tune for as long as you own the car. If you buy the Predator from someone else, he will give you unlimited custom tunes for $100. You can find him at diablosporttuning.com. I am very happy with my custom tune. He did an amazing job on my shifts (much better than the Predator came with), fixed my LT's which were screwed up due to my K&N CAI, raised my speed limiter to 250 MPH (as if!!!) and, overall, knocked two tenths off my quarter mile to 13.68 last Sunday. By next spring, I plan to have Nitto drag radials for sure (I just spin like a SOB) and, maybe, NOS...I'm still thinking about that (I leased my car so I want something that's easy to remove in three years when I turn it in).
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