Help! Looking at '65 Project - Pontiac GTO Forum
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post #1 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-21-2014, 06:14 PM Thread Starter
 
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Help! Looking at '65 Project

All, hello. Been lurking awhile and may have had a diamond drop in my lap. 1965, #'s matching, 4 barrel, 389, 2 speed auto. PS. Almost zero rust, engine Nd tranny have been used in other car for a decade, car has been garaged and in pieces for 30 years. Engine had nearly 200k miles on it before it was taken apart and has been rebuilt since. All parts are present, bagged and tagged. Original paint with some touch up.

What should I pay for her???

Thanks In advance!
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post #2 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-21-2014, 06:26 PM
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Need pictures. If it's apart and not a running/driving car, less than 8k for sure. An automatic 4bbl GTO is a base GTO, and worth less coin than a stickshift or tripower (or both) car. Very nice driver quality automatic 4bbl '65 GTO's can be had for 25k or less in the present market. The cost of restoring one, however, even a good one, is going to be 30k-60k and up. Very easy to spend a lot more on a project car than it'll be worth. But, please, post some pics and we'll be able to narrow it down.
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post #3 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-21-2014, 10:08 PM Thread Starter
 
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Thanks!

Trying to link to photobucket album...might need to do this from another device. If during the restore I shoot for a Day 2 and go with the Tri Power do I capture that value? Or is the original spec the be all end all?

Sorry I'm as green as they come!





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Originally Posted by geeteeohguy View Post
Need pictures. If it's apart and not a running/driving car, less than 8k for sure. An automatic 4bbl GTO is a base GTO, and worth less coin than a stickshift or tripower (or both) car. Very nice driver quality automatic 4bbl '65 GTO's can be had for 25k or less in the present market. The cost of restoring one, however, even a good one, is going to be 30k-60k and up. Very easy to spend a lot more on a project car than it'll be worth. But, please, post some pics and we'll be able to narrow it down.
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post #4 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-22-2014, 06:40 AM
 
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This is perhaps one of the most common questions/topics in the industry regardless of make or model. To assist your efforts you need to lay out what you can or will do personally, what your mechanical and fabrication talents are, and give an honest assessment of the car's condition. While cool as hell the engine and trans were reunited with the car it doesn't matter if it was originally a lower end model. The work is the same but it ends there. Next, what are the plans for it? I'm a "day 2" fan myself and that seems to be gaining a bit of momentum in the market. That direction is very easy to screw up though. Wrong wheel/tire combinations, tachs and gauges slapped in from any period, braided stainless buulcrap, nothing even close to a true 60s day 2. Real parts cost money and require patience to find. Done well they can indeed exceed what the generic restoration will bring. But getting back to cost, suppose the car needed a 1/4 panel. An Asian import replacement is so bad I refuse to do em. I'd source the real thing from out west and proceed from there. Total hours that way are nearly the same but the salvaged part needs to be brought up to spec before installation. Floors are a pain sometimes and you can count on twice the rust you see if any. Then you mentioned the car sitting for 30yrs. It was 20yrs old already, and unless it was pampered by western weather or a loving owner road conditions took a toll twice as easy as what we see today (except Dodge trucks (!) ). Whatever you don't have to do you save roughly $65/hr in restoration costs. Your final estimate of value has to come from averaged totals of recorded sales. "My buddy got $75K for his..." doesn't play. Mecum results are a good source, even Old Cars Price Guide can be a big help. At the end of all this babble, a good day 2 with kool parts and disciplined attention to detail can see mid to high 30s. At that point it has less to do with numbers and paper but they still rule the day. It has to be the real thing to begin with. As to it's current state, as was indicated above we need pics to guess a fair value, but I'd like to know what the current owner wants. Beware of those who "fish". A serious seller knows what they want in advance of offering it.
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post #5 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-22-2014, 11:08 AM
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I agree with what triple6 said except for one thing: all else being equal, an original 4 speed tripower car will always command 35-50% more money than a like-restored but upgraded base model. That's the reality of it with GTO's., and pretty much all muscle cars. '40 Fords, not so much. Packard 120's, not so much.
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post #6 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-22-2014, 03:08 PM Thread Starter
 
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Great replies, guys!

Trying pics now...
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post #7 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-22-2014, 03:10 PM Thread Starter
 
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Second set of pics
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post #8 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-22-2014, 03:28 PM Thread Starter
 
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Whew! Glad those uploaded.
With regard to how much work Iíd be doing: very little to a moderate amount of Ďturning a wrench.í Due to work and family constraints, Iíd hope to get it underway in the next 5 years. Donít mind being upside down by $10k when itís all said and done. My Dad is a big C2 Vette guy and #ís matching with orig equip is huge in that market. Wondered if the same applied here? Also, my vernacular may be off a bit: when I say Day 2, Iím thinking of adding things that were options originally on the 65, not necessarily aftermarket products that were available in that era.
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post #9 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-22-2014, 05:58 PM
 
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Original Paint With Touch Up

When you say original paint with touch up what was the original color?
Did the seller give you "an out the door price" and it is yours?
Do you have pictures of the bagged and numbered parts you mentioned?
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post #10 of 35 (permalink) Old 11-22-2014, 06:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by georgegervin44 View Post
All, hello. Been lurking awhile and may have had a diamond drop in my lap. 1965, #'s matching, 4 barrel, 389, 2 speed auto. PS. Almost zero rust, engine Nd tranny have been used in other car for a decade, car has been garaged and in pieces for 30 years. Engine had nearly 200k miles on it before it was taken apart and has been rebuilt since. All parts are present, bagged and tagged. Original paint with some touch up.

What should I pay for her???

Thanks In advance!
Looks like more than "almost zero rust" based on your photos. I would want some good photos of the frame and under carriage if you haven't got any.

I get nervous when someone else claims the engine has been rebuilt; define "rebuilt". I would rather have it as is so that I could rebuild it and know what was in the engine and what machine work had been performed on it. A rebuilt engine is not always a plus in my book.

Looks like a ground up, but not frame off, is needed. Has definite potential. With all those years on it, my guess is that dry rot has taken its toll on rubber and possibly interior pieces. Remember that these older cars do not wear like the cars of today. At 60,000 miles, front-ends become worn out, engines were tired, rear suspensions got loose, etc., so expect to rebuild most of the car. What is the original miles on the car?

Numbers matching is a good thing for someone who wants that. My opinion on its value because of numbers matching is that you would have to find a very specific buyer, especially wanting the 2 speed automatic, and along with this, a restoration back to factory original would have to go with that. To upgrade the engine with a tri-power/more HP and 4-speed/OD automatic and go after a performance build would most likely appeal to a broader buyer market and may actually pull a higher value in resale if done right, while not necessarily having to go all original and including modern upgrades like disc brakes & sway bars.

To go numbers matching and then follow up with an original resto may become costly and may not yield your investment back. Of course if you simply plan on keeping it a lifetime and are not interested in selling it once you have possession of it, then cost may be irrelavent -like most of us, they become projects that never "quite" get finished and we keep putting more money into them.
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