Pontiac GTO Forum banner

1 - 20 of 32 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi, I have come across what appears to be a 70 Judge sitting on an old farm. I have spoken to the owner of the car and he tells me that it is in fact a real 70 Judge with a 400/400 and rare ac. The vin on the dash was to dirty to read clearly and he is finding me the title this week. I am a Trans Am guy and would like some info on this car if anyone can help. It has a Ram air hood (functional with the handle under the dash), Judge emblem on the dash, there was a rear wing (stolen) and he told me the trunk spring was heavy duty due to the wing but the only thing that I question is the vinyl top. It is original white with black interior which I think most Judges are orange or blue. Anyone?
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
Barn find Judge pt 2

Just a few more pictires of the car. Also the car has a 140 mph speedo and tach. The door panels have a GTO emblem as well. If anyone can help in letting me know if its a real Judge or not it would be greatly appreciated. I can have this car with a lot of parts for $2,000.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
155 Posts
judges for 1970 could be had in any available gto color.this car has all the tell-tale signs of a judge,unless somebody added the ram-air pans and graphics along with the glove box emblem.have you seen the car in person?if you can,check the casting # on the heads.if it is 12 or 614,then it's probably a ram-air 3 or iv motor,which is what the judge would have come with.the only sure way to tell is a phs report.so get the vin # and pay the 60.00 or so and you'll find out in a couple of days.if this turns out to be authentic,then this would be the deal of your lifetime.good luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
I had seen this car today and snapped a few pics. I didnt grab the numbers off the block. The guy has had this car for 25 years and just let it go to what you see today. The block and trans are original though. Are there any companies making repo parts for these cars? Like a Ram air hood?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
155 Posts
ames performance makes the aftermarket hoods for 70,but you would have to cut some under-bracing for the ram air components.if i were you,i would find a nice solid donor car and use it's metal.you can probably find an original ram-air hood,but it's going to cost quite a bit.how's the frame?
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
8,433 Posts
The PHS is the only real way to tell. Chances are its the real deal, the quest to clone wasn't then what it is now. The wheels as depicted in the pic are not GTO but back then many purchased aftermarket. Those wheels are cheapy steel. Could be a variety of reasons for them being on there. Hood scoops are the correct color. Judge decal on the fender is missing, (after all these years could just be missing) was there decals on the other places?
One interesting thing I noticed.... no tach either on the hood (I don't see a hole in the hood) or in dash. The dash indicates a clock. I don't recall a judge without a tach but it could have been ordered that way, the PHS will indicate it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
155 Posts
thats funny judge,i noticed that also.could it be the angle of the photo,and as he stated,the original wing was stolen,maybe the tach was swiped also and we can't see the hole from the photo?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
155 Posts
sorry judge,just looked at the first post and the photo clearly shows no tach.could that have been a special order?although i don't know why someone would choose the clock over a tach.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
8,433 Posts
OK,,,, I merged the threads I didn't see the other pics now I do.
I am thinking this is a clone.

1. The trim rings seen on the driver side were not an option on a Judge, it was a factory delete however they were a dealer ordered part and could be gotten as an add on.
2. No Tach
3. Unless there are holes in the deck lid no spoiler.
4. No judge decals and no indication they were on although the stripes are in tact.
5. No "GTO" on the left grille but that's mute could have been stolen... however the grilles are black.
6. Not seeing a chin spoiler (air foil) but I have seen pics of judges without them
7. If glove box is missing the emblem and there are no holes in it where it used to be this is another sign of a fake.

It is a Ram Air engine, the engine alone could be worth the cost of the car.

Again, the PHS will confirm.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
8,433 Posts
sorry judge,just looked at the first post and the photo clearly shows no tach.could that have been a special order?although i don't know why someone would choose the clock over a tach.
That's what I thought. The only thing I am seeing that it is correct for a Judge is color of the scoops, and the RA. I am seeing more inconsistencies with this being a Judge than not.
 

·
64-67 Expert
Joined
·
8,569 Posts
I am no Judge expert, but there's something about this car that makes me believe it's the real thing. If it's a clone, it was done LONG before anybody bothered......back in the day, they would have put the spoiler on, but not bothered with the correct Ram Air knob and stripes. I'm hoping it's a real one. Nice find.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
8,433 Posts
I am no Judge expert, but there's something about this car that makes me believe it's the real thing. If it's a clone, it was done LONG before anybody bothered......back in the day, they would have put the spoiler on, but not bothered with the correct Ram Air knob and stripes. I'm hoping it's a real one. Nice find.
I was thinking the same thing. Cloning them out was not like it is now but 25 + years ago someone may have put some stripes on it. As I looked closer at it just from the pics provided too many inconsistencies with it being real but who knows, back then there was no real consorted effort to preserve them. I hope it is real though, the polar white is a nice color. The rear deck spoiler would have been black. Someone may have snatched it. I hope there is a follow up to this I am intrigued.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
I was thinking the same thing. Cloning them out was not like it is now but 25 + years ago someone may have put some stripes on it. As I looked closer at it just from the pics provided too many inconsistencies with it being real but who knows, back then there was no real consorted effort to preserve them. I hope it is real though, the polar white is a nice color. The rear deck spoiler would have been black. Someone may have snatched it. I hope there is a follow up to this I am intrigued.
Thanks for the upkeep. I did see the holes in the trunk where the spoiler once was and there was holes in the glove box door where the now broken emblem once was. I do not recall a tach but didnt check to see if there was one in the dash next to the speedo. It was however a 140 speedo if this helps. All of the wheels were stolen and now sit on rollers as well
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
8,433 Posts
Thanks for the upkeep. I did see the holes in the trunk where the spoiler once was and there was holes in the glove box door where the now broken emblem once was. I do not recall a tach but didnt check to see if there was one in the dash next to the speedo. It was however a 140 speedo if this helps. All of the wheels were stolen and now sit on rollers as well
I can see the clock set in the pic. I am puzzled as to why a clock and no tach. I am puzzled as to why the stripes but not the decals. Someone could have peeled them off. It very well could be the real deal and most probably is then if the remnants of the stolen items are there. If you are interested in the car you can get an expedited Vin verification from PHS, that is an additional 15.00 cost I believe. That motor is the ticket item here. Those other parts are easily obtained. Let us know how you make out with it if you pursue it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
I can see the clock set in the pic. I am puzzled as to why a clock and no tach. I am puzzled as to why the stripes but not the decals. Someone could have peeled them off. It very well could be the real deal and most probably is then if the remnants of the stolen items are there. If you are interested in the car you can get an expedited Vin verification from PHS, that is an additional 15.00 cost I believe. That motor is the ticket item here. Those other parts are easily obtained. Let us know how you make out with it if you pursue it.
Thanks, I am making the arrangments to have the car removed this upcoming weekend and I will post new info from time to time!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
My 70 Judge has the clock option (code 492, 14.04). No tach in mine either.

With the automatic, you punched it and held on!!!

:cool:cool:cool
 
1 - 20 of 32 Posts
Top