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First off you might be wondering about the name, don't worry we will get to that. First I wanna fill you in on the story of me and this car. I bought it in November of 2012 after my first tour to Afghanistan. I loved the car from the be gaining and got it road worthy then drove the hell out of it. Now it's time for some change. I'm tired of it pissing every petroleum product it has all over the drive way lol. "Bastard" started its life in 68 as a lemans and ended up in someone's shop in Indiana I'm guessing in the late 90s, this guy made it into a GTO... Cheaply. Then a man from the San Diego area bought it and decided to paint it carousel orange ( you can guess where I'm going) and slapped some stickers on it in order to call it a judge. Well you can't fool me with your tricks! I knew what I was getting and was not about to pay the 20 large that he wanted for this tin can... Leaky tin can, so I walked away at 10200 bucks. I felt and still do feel good about it. The only rust I have found is the underside rear of the hood (bent any ways) and the package tray from a leaking rear window. The hood is a gto hood and the trunk has been drilled for a 69 spoiler. It has a 400 block with a performer intake and carb. A th400 tranny and stock lemans rear end. I bought a butler 455 block and rotating assembly (ran for about 2 hours total) from a friend last summer and learned pontiac parts are not cheap so I spent my current deployment buying the following parts.

Power plant: balanced 455 with stock crank, rods and icon pistons (sealed power rings). Edelbrock heads reworked buy butler. Doug's headers and stage 8 header and collector bolts. Aluminum water pump, valley pan, filter housing, vitron rear main, ARP studs for heads and mains from hammertime. Planning on a Schindler custom grind cam, crower lifers, and stamped steel roller tip rockers. All buttoned up with fabbed alum valve covers, performer intake and holly 750 double pumper. Filters, sending unit, pump and starter from robbmc.

Tranny and Rear end: I plan on keeping the TH400 but rebuild it with a B&M kit and alum deep pan. Haven't sourced a converter yet. The driveshaft is going to be rebuilt and balanced. Planning on keeping the rear housing just gut it and start over. So far I have a auburn possi, 3.36 gear set, and a rebuild kit. Will be getting a set of axles from strange.

Suspension and Steering: SC&C touring plus package, stock spindles, jeep grand steering box and lee pump.

Brakes: I decided to jump on the hydro band wagon for the main reason of my cam will not produce enough vacuum. All new stainless lines. Braided flex lines. Rear 11 inch drilled and slotted disks from matts classic bowties. Front 12.88 inch wildwood super lite 6Rs. I haven't decided on a master yet.

Here's some pictures let me know what you think.
 

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Welcome. Nice project sounds like to me. Good looking car too, glad you've found a solid one. Another member on here from Germany just bought a 68 "judge" clone (real GTO) and it was shiny paint over bondo and rust. He's currently replacing or patching most of the sheet metal.






Are you planning on keeping it a 68' Judge.......:skep:?

Oh, and thanks for your service :patriot: :cheers.
 

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Arrrg nothing I hate more than a 68 faked into a Judge. I would rather drive the car with green house paint applied with a 3" wide brush. Yuk. Looks like you got a pretty good car there at a pretty good price.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Don't worry guys I hate the paint as much as the next guy. Up close it looks like it was done at mako. The seams in some places are still black. I'm really not sure what I'm gonna do yet. I like the orange, but it needs to be broken up a bit. ImageUploadedByAG Free1398273185.067115.jpg ImageUploadedByAG Free1398273224.865103.jpg

For now all that talk is just pipe dreams till I get it mechanically how I want it. That's the main thing. Is it safe and is it fast?


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Nice car. Definitely a very good base for drivable project. I would gladly take the condition of your car over the condition of my car. Sounds like you are on your way to a really nice car.

Although I do like the "Judge" look, I tend to agree and not like the '68 Judge clone. I have a '68 convertible and I am leaning towards a '68 GTO Pro Touring with cues from a Judge (i.e. the rear spoiler and a similar stripe, but no "Judge" badges).
 

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I like that one two, but i need a way to make it work with black interior.
It would work. You could do the lower dash in body color and maybe some misc trim items to tie it all together. A Suede headliner in the same color would be cool. Just can't overdo it. All black interior can really go with anything IMO although I love the colored interiors in these cars, it really brightens up the cabin.

I like the first look too and that might be something to consider if you can remove your existing Judge stripes. I don't see why you couldn't then scuff it down, paint or decal on the new stripes and then matte clear the whole thing. Would totally change the look of your car.

I've been thinking about whether or not to put some kind of stripe on my GTO to break up all the orange. I like the Judge stripes but I'm already tired of telling people it's not a Judge lol. Just looking for something different and I kinda regret some times painting it Orange although I don't necessarily hate it lol.
 

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My idea is I am going with Red for the car, very red. Then doing a "Judge like" stripe, meaning same shape, but not done with triple color. The color of the stripe I have in mind is dark Chameleon (color shifting depending on light) with a gold edge around stripe. No "Judge" decals on car. I plan on doing essentially a black interior, but to be different, I like the idea of the lower dash being color of car and I like the brushed aluminum look for dash face instead of the factory woodgrain.

As much as I do like the Carousel Red (orange) color on GTO's, I agree, it has been over done a bit. Since my car is not a numbers matching, I do not mind taking a chance a little with options like color, interior trim and wheels.
 

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I love the green surprisingly... I (generally) hate green cars. And you're doing a lot better off than most even if it is a Le mans cloned GTO cloned Judge. Good luck with the project!
 

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One of the nice things about having a "Bastard" is it gives you some design freedom, as you do not have to worry about numbers matching, correctness, or potential value.

Building a classic Pontiac was a "bucket list" thing for me. Was either gonna be a 69' firebird like my first car or a 66'-67' GTO like the one that got away before i bought the firebird. After tabbing up what a restoration would cost in my head (way off) and adding in the price for a half way decent bodied starter Bird or GTO, it looked out of reach. I just kinda fell into the Tempest on Craigslist in Idaho with a worn out 326 and baked interior. The car had been sitting in a carport since 1976 had all born with metal and trim, no rust through body, and straight frame with original Barrier Blue paint sealed with epoxy primer by PO who found it buried in the carport. I knew i wanted to do some mild custom stuff so it seamed a good fit, and for probably a quarter of what it would have cost if it were a "GTO" in the same condition. In 11 months i replaced or reconditioned nearly every part on it body on frame by myself, learned to do body...then paint when i got a few quotes on it and heard the horror stories of body shops. Then I had short block stroker 462 machined and assembled for me to drop in it. Along the way i built the car as if it was my high school car and did what I liked with no remorse about altering an original automotive
icon..."it's just a Tempest"...and i love it!!!

Envision the car you want in your head, find a picture of one you like the cut of and make it your computer background screen to inspire you. Then just build it to please yourself and drive the tires off of it. That's what they are made for.
 

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I was thinking about it today and came up with gray, a black strip (much like the orange pic) to brake it up. Then all the Crome painted black.


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A full paint job is not gonna be cheap. You could do the existing orange with the black stripe and save major $$$ (not to mention the downtime) and then do the color change down the road if that is the look you are going after. Part of that look is a wheel/tire and suspension change that will also take a chunk out of your wallet.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
A full paint job is not gonna be cheap. You could do the existing orange with the black stripe and save major $$$ (not to mention the downtime) and then do the color change down the road if that is the look you are going after. Part of that look is a wheel/tire and suspension change that will also take a chunk out of your wallet.
I do like that idea, but there is a few spots that where never painted when someone replaced the front fender. it looks like they painted it with it on the car. the back edge is still black. I will need to make sure that they can touch that up at the same time I'm sure they can. Theres a great article that i read about teaching you how to wet sand the top coat. That sounds kinda crazy for a do it yourself kinda guy like me.

I already have the suspension taken care of. I went with the SC&C kit due to all there great reviews and service. Mark is one of the most intelligent guys i have ever talked to about handling and he talked a lot about safety. :crazy:
 

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You could touch it up yourself, need to find out what kind of paint they used, most newer jobs are basecoat, clearcoat two part, meaning the color or base coat dries satin and the clear is laid on top usually in 3-4 additional coats. The older paints were enamel single stage that were color that dried to a gloss. Both systems can be color sanded and buffed but on a BC/CC you need to make sure you don't cut through the clear coat to the color.
 

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Neither did i until i researched and did it all myself, like Akly said body and paint is EXPENSIVE (5-15K)!! Probably the single biggest cost of a restoration, so if you can learn by touching up and fixing what you have it will be money saved and knowledge gained. Quality materials alone for complete body paint can run a couple grand and labor is 70-100 an hour. Check out Paintification.com, great resource for learning about the process required to paint it yourself, or at the very least know what you are talking about when you do go to a professional. Also remember when you take your car to a body shop it will be in limbo until they are done with it, check old threads for some horror stories.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Sorry I have been absent for awhile. I got back in the states a week ago and started going through all the parts sitting around my house. Let me tell you, it looks like a lot less on an invoice. A corner of my room is full of car parts.

I pulled the dash as soon as i got back only to find some surface rust. What do you think i should do about it? I was thinking to wire wheel it the seal with some sort of paint. What do you all think?

Last night I started on the motor and drive train. I got the Radiator, fan and all the front accessories off. pulled the driveshaft and hooked up the cherry picker. It turns out that the car is to low for the wheels to fit under. Anyone ever run into this? I was thinking to just Block up the front a few inches.

I will post some pics when i can.
 
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