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Discussion Starter #1
My boss has a 2000 Camaro Z28 SS. It's got heads and cam, intake, headers, hi flow cats, and an SLP Loudmouth. He also has 4.10 gears. The car is really loud and with the 4.10's it scrams real quick in 1st.

He was on his way to work this morning. his radar detector had been going off like crazy, so he was running pretty close to the speed limit. He got stopped at a traffic light and was turning left. The intersection had 2 left turn lanes and a Chevy Silverado 4dr Z71 was beside him.

They both turned left onto a 6 lane hwy that has a 50 mph speed limit. They took off a little quick, but not anything you would call racing. The truck got ahead of him, he shifted out of 1st at around 3000-3500. He shifted from second at 2500-3000, and made 3rd and 4th at about 2500. He went from 4th to 6th gear and began to cruise at 55 in a 50mph zone.

About a half mile down the road he saw a couple of cop cars with lights and sirens coming up on him at a real high rate of speed. He moved over behind the pick up to give them both lanes to go by. 1 cop car dives in front of him and one dives in front of the pick-up, stopping them both.

Well as you guessed he got cited for drag racing. The cop told him he was clocked going 95 mph. He asked to see the radar gun and the cop said well maybe it wasn't 95, but it was really fast. He said he hadn't gotten above 55 and wasn't drag racing. Cop didn't hear anything of it. He needs to appear in court on Jan 8th. Wish him luck.

The thing that has him the angriest is, this is one of the times he legitimately wasn't doing anything wrong. The cop must have heard the loud exhaust. I'm thinking he is going to have a tough fight since there were two cops in two cars that saw them take off.

In Florida there is jail time, loss of license, fines and they can take your car for street racing if he gets convicted.
 

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It must be "quota time" for the swines. The reason I say that is because what you speak of here is obviously BS (if indeed it went down like that). When the cop back peddled when asked to see the radar proves that this is a bogus ticket. I would have demanded to see the radar. I would have went as far as to take a picture of the radar reading with my camera phone to have as evidence if it didn't show the same mph that was written on the ticket. What a crock!!
 

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That's about 15 ways jacked up! What kind of proof do the cops have that they were racing? Any skid marks? I'm betting (and hoping) they can both beat this one.
 

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Thought you got popped in your Vette there for a second, FF. As you well know, that's how traffic enforcement works. Banana republic kangaroo "guilty until proven innocent" crap.

Seriously, I wouldn't worry too much about this. It will be expensive, though. Just tell your boss to spend the money and get a good attorney. You'll be amazed at how much crap they can throw out.

For starters, if the police cars have video recorders -- then have them bring the tapes in. You can have an analysis of the speed if the cars are in view. That is solid proof right there that the charge is BS.

Keep us posted. Curious to find out how this winds up.
 

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They just want your money.

Like when I was stopped for no tag, was in grace period was ticketed and beat that. Also got hit for no insurnance had insurance brought papers to court 3 times still had to pay it,
 

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Just a quick thought. Why did he decide to race at all, even if it was not hard acceleration, with his radar detector going off like crazy just a mile or so earlier?!?!?! :confused
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Hey Fergy, were you there to witness all of this? Just remember, you are only hearing one side of the story. :cheers
I'm hearing one side of the story from the person I know. He's the type of guy that would accept everything, including getting his car taken away, if he was guilty.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Just a quick thought. Why did he decide to race at all, even if it was not hard acceleration, with his radar detector going off like crazy just a mile or so earlier?!?!?! :confused
That's the killer, they didn't race. The police officers heard my boss's loud exhaust and assumed the guys were racing. He has a heads n cam, headers and an open SLP loudmouth exhaust. He also has 4.10 gears so the sound winds up real quick and by 30mph he's thinking of 4th, so it sounds like he's winding it out. From where they were at, they couldn't even see the car, just the truck. They were six cars back in a line of traffic. They just assumed from the noise that he was racing.

As an update, in the police report, the police officer has it listed that he VISUALLY clocked the car and truck. He ESTIMATED the speed of the car to be in excess of 85 mph and the truck to be in excess of 90mph. So my boss just got beat by a stock Z71 Silverado. :rolleyes:

My boss's driving record is going to help him a bunch. He's been living in Florida for 16 years and never been cited for any moving violations. His Texas record has one speeding ticket in 1983 for 62mph in a 55 zone. No other moving violations.

He has made the decision to fight this as far as he needs to. He has a good attorney and is not accepting anything other than a ticket for 5 mph over the speed limit, which is what he was doing.
 

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That's the killer, they didn't race. The police officers heard my boss's loud exhaust and assumed the guys were racing. He has a heads n cam, headers and an open SLP loudmouth exhaust. He also has 4.10 gears so the sound winds up real quick and by 30mph he's thinking of 4th, so it sounds like he's winding it out. From where they were at, they couldn't even see the car, just the truck. They were six cars back in a line of traffic. They just assumed from the noise that he was racing.

As an update, in the police report, the police officer has it listed that he VISUALLY clocked the car and truck. He ESTIMATED the speed of the car to be in excess of 85 mph and the truck to be in excess of 90mph. So my boss just got beat by a stock Z71 Silverado. :rolleyes:

My boss's driving record is going to help him a bunch. He's been living in Florida for 16 years and never been cited for any moving violations. His Texas record has one speeding ticket in 1983 for 62mph in a 55 zone. No other moving violations.

He has made the decision to fight this as far as he needs to. He has a good attorney and is not accepting anything other than a ticket for 5 mph over the speed limit, which is what he was doing.

If he supena's the officer to show up at court and he questions the manner in wich his speed was detected, That is so easily a dissmised case!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
If he supena's the officer to show up at court and he questions the manner in wich his speed was detected, That is so easily a dissmised case!
The good thing is, the officer already has to show up. If he is a no show the case will more than likely be dismissed.

He's going after 2 things, the officer was unable to see the car visually due to traffic, there was never any speed recorded using radar, just an officers guess.

There was a guy on a bicycle, on his way to work also, that saw them. The guy driving the pick-up was able to find this guy. The bicycle guy will testify that the two vehicles took off at a normal speed.
 

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That's the killer, they didn't race. The police officers heard my boss's loud exhaust and assumed the guys were racing. QUOTE]

Ooooohhhhh. :eek: Wow. Not cool. That makes me want to go the sleeper route with my car for sure, so cops will not think i am racing when I am just exiting the driveway. :lol: . But good luck to your boss and I'd fight it to the death too or until I ran out of money for lawyer fees.
 

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He "visually clocked" the cars? That's not gonna be admissible in any court in the USA...unless he's had his eyeballs calibrated so he can discern 55 from 57 miles per hour! <big SMIRK here>

I suspect this case will be thrown out on its ear. I was a cop for several years, and occasionally some shady things were done to give some tickets that may not have been necessarily warranted (not by me though). In this case, the lawyer will probably get it all chucked out of court, because it sounds like a bogus ticket. If the cops have cameras in the car (which they probably don't, or they wouldn't have pulled crap like this), that evidence will be shown in court. I'm a firm believer that we need cameras in every police/sheriff/highway patrol car in the USA...both for the officers' safety AND to keep the cop from doing stuff like happened to your boss.

You want to know why you see these guys in very expensive cars going fast, passing you and YOU are the one who gets pulled over in your GTO or Camaro? Because the cop knows that the guy in the expensive car is much more likely to take the ticket to court, or hand it over to his lawyer to fight the ticket...whereas someone in a Camaro may be a younger person who would probably just pay the ticket and go on with their lives. That may be because they don't have the $$ to get a lawyer, can't get off of work, or any number of other reasons. People with the money almost always fight the tickets, which means a trip to court (which always seemed to fall on my day off when I was a cop)...and cops don't really like going to court for tickets. Yes, it's a part of the job and yes, we get paid to go to court for tickets, but it's not something we like to do.

Anyway, *visually* estimating speed is not gonna stand up in court. So I wouldn't worry too much about this if I were your boss.

I always carry a little voice recorder with me, for situations like this. Here in missouri, as long as one party in the conversation (me) knows they're being recorded, it's legal. You don't even have to tell the cop that you're recording what he says. In other states, that may not be the case, so check out your local laws before doing this. If you know you're getting a ticket, go ahead and just tell the cop you're recording him, there should be no law against it. I suspect a little voice recorder would have helped immensely in this situation, especially when the officer said that he *visually* saw them going 85-90 mph. The judge would hear that and chuck it out of court so fast it would make the cop's head spin.

It's cops like these that give the rest a bad name. The vast majority of cops are honest, and are trying to keep the roads safe when they write tickets...not just being jerks. When I had to write someone a ticket, I took a lot of information into account, I explained to them exactly what the did wrong and why I pulled them over and I was always very courteous to the person. I've actually had people tell me "thanks, have a nice day" after writing them a ticket! In my opinion, there's no excuse for cops to pull crap like they did to your boss. There are much better ways to spend their time...like catching/ticketing REAL speeders and people who are endangering others. This is a rant for another thread though. ;)

Tell your boss I said good luck, but I really don't think he's got much to worry about based on what I have read.
 

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He "visually clocked" the cars? That's not gonna be admissible in any court in the USA...unless he's had his eyeballs calibrated so he can discern 55 from 57 miles per hour! <big SMIRK here>
Actually, visual estimate is admissible in court. During radar certification, officers have to take a block of instruction (about 40 hours) of visual estimates of speed.

In court, the proper method of testifying is to visually estimate a speed and then verify with radar. The speeds are not always going to be exactly the same (visual estimate 45, radar confirmed 47), but it will stand in court.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I was going to post an update here, but not much is new.

The first hearing was more of a get the ticket into the system move. The cop didn't need to show and didn't show. They asked my boss to enter a plea, which was not guilty. The judge then set a trial date.

The visual as far as the speed is not admissable for a speeding ticket, but is for a "too fast for conditions" ticket, reckless driving and drag racing. They are not interested in actual speed, but the act of racing. You don't need to go over the speed limit to be racing.

His attorney told him they would probably offer him a reckless driving ticket which would be better than the drag racing. He told his attorney money was no object and he was not going to plead to anything other than 5 mph over the limit. That's what he did.

Next trial is Feb 8th. I'll keep updating.
 
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