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Discussion Starter #1
Hi all, I have been reading alot of the posts here and find it very entertaining.
I have a 68 GTO, a 70 GTO, and a 69 Hurst Olds, so I know a little about Muscle Cars.
I was/am totally enthusiastic about the re-intro of the "new" goat. A friend of mine bought a yellow auto, and he loves the car. (leaves every parking lot sideways)

I somehow take it personally when people keep comparing the 04 to a Cavalier in looks.

I guess what i do not understand is that some of you say you love the stealthyness( is that a word?) of the 04, but then others say they love the attention they get when they pull up at a light( stares, questions ,etc)

maybe both.

Also, It seems that some of you get really offensive when you hear someone trash your 04, and then you trash the New Mustang( or other make).

What pisses me off about the new Mustang is what a great job( my opinion) Ford did on that car, and that GM should have done something similar with the Goat.

Ford is going to sell a sh#tload of those cars, and I dont blame people for buying them.

Chrysler comes up with some really innovative cars like the 300 and the Magnum(again my opinion) and GM drops the Trans Am and the Camaro and comes up with the SSR, a retro PU that is neither fast, cannot be used as a truck, can only carry 2 people, and costs as much as a Vette.

Somethings wrong at the General

You guys/gals with new Goats. I am sure for the most part are happy with your cars, some happier than others, depending on the $$ deal you got, but happy. But i still think, deep down, you wish GM would have done a better job with the styling of "our GTO"

Go ahead and admit it,"The Truth Will Set You Free" :cheers

your response is welcomed
 

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> Hi all, I have been reading alot of the posts here and find it very
> entertaining. I have a 68 GTO, a 70 GTO, and a 69 Hurst Olds,
> so I know a little about Muscle Cars.
>
> I was/am totally enthusiastic about the re-intro of the "new" goat.
> A friend of mine bought a yellow auto, and he loves the car. (leaves
> every parking lot sideways)
"Crabs walk sidewalks; lobsters walk straight and we'll never let you take her for your bride"

> I somehow take it personally when people keep comparing the 04 to a
>Cavalier in looks.
I've never heard it compared to a Cavalier. A Dodge Stratus, but never a Cavalier.

> I guess what i do not understand is that some of you say you love the
> stealthyness (is that a word?) of the 04, but then others say they love
> the attention they get when they pull up at a light (stares, questions,
> etc) maybe both.
I've said before, the car does NOT have very distinctive styling. It does look similar to many other cars. SO to the uninitiated, is does sort of blend into the crowd a bit -until- you hear it, or see it move. THEN it is distinctive.

>Also, It seems that some of you get really offensive when you hear
>someone trash your 04, and then you trash the New Mustang (or other
>make).
I've never "trashed" the new Mustang... and I don't particularly recall anybody here doing that either.

> What pisses me off about the new Mustang is what a great job (my
>opinion) Ford did on that car, and that GM should have done something
>similar with the Goat.
>
>Ford is going to sell a sh#tload of those cars, and I dont blame people
>for buying them.
Well, I certainly agree that Ford is going to sell them like hot cakes. Its Thanksgiving and while watching the football games I saw MANY Ford and Mustang commercials. Guess how many Pontiac/GTO commercials. 0.

How does any manf expect to sell cars without making the general public aware of them!!!

Now I can't personally say the new Mustang is as good a car as the GTO is, I've never driven one, but better doesn't always "win".

>Chrysler comes up with some really innovative cars like the 300 and the
>Magnum(again my opinion) and GM drops the Trans Am and the Camaro
>and comes up with the SSR, a retro PU that is neither fast, cannot be used
>as a truck, can only carry 2 people, and costs as much as a Vette.
>
>Somethings wrong at the General
I can't fault them for making "innovative" vehicles. But they do seem to have a difficulty getting the price to match the market, and to make that market AWARE of the vehicle!

>You guys/gals with new Goats. I am sure for the most part are happy with
>your cars, some happier than others, depending on the $$ deal you got, but
>happy. But i still think, deep down, you wish GM would have done a better
>job with the styling of "our GTO"
I am very happy with the car as it stands. If GM would have done something different, then no doubt it would have made some people more happy, and some people less happy. An even balance? Who's to say? Style is such a "personal" thing. What appeals to one, doesn't another.
Go ahead and admit it,"The Truth Will Set You Free" :cheers

>your response is welcomed

Thanks!
---Larry
 

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What are we supposed to admit? Quite frankly I feel your post has no merit for arguments in this forum; your thoughts are from one side of the spectrum to the other and are not articulated to warrant a “peaceful” gathering of ideas. More than likely you will see your fair share of flaming though most is justified.

Now before I unplug from this world that we know only as the matrix to catch some sleep before joining what can only be explained as mass hysteria with all of the other crazies on Black Friday (wife’s brilliant idea), I will step onto the soap box and add my input…

Exclusivity. As much as I could possibly try, the inevitable fact remains that I can never give justice towards this 2 ton beast; no one can. While I will admit that the redesign of the 05 Mustang is a radical change and marketing brilliance by Ford, the question remains the same - what will this bring to its owners? These cars will become the “dime a dozen” commodity that will saturate not only every street corner but also my open highway and will only bring heartbreak to so many owners as even the big, bold GT couldn’t hold a candle to my Goat. Unfortunately neither I, nor anyone for that matter wants this post to become too lengthy because this will probably become a “hot” topic and many posters will put in their 2 cents. I certainly do not understand what point you are try to make as it seems there are about 4 or 5 topics in your post. I merely hit on the one that bothers me the most “Ford is going to sell a sh#tload of those cars, and I dont blame people for buying them.” Be that as it may, however, I was one not to stand in the same line as the guy in front and behind, I always enjoyed creating my own identity and the 04 GTO serves me perfectly. Also as I stated in another post, there is no better feeling than stopping at a red light looking over at the adjacent vehicles and without saying a word they are already thinking “Damn that car is better looking, and faster than mine.”
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I admit I did touch on a few, maybe even too many, points for one post.
I got a little carried away.

as to sboylan
My point is do you really think the majority of people even recognize the 04 GTO for what it is? Even I ( who is pretty bias infavor of the 04) have a problem telling it from so many other late model "sport sedans" without looking close.
As to the Mustang. You seem to think that if a lot of people like something and buy it and they seem " a dime a dozen" as if thats a bad thing.
In the old days, VW bugs were everywhere, and I dont think it was because they were following a trend, they saw an xlint car,at an xlint price that were superior to the competion

I think the new Mustang is the same thing, give the people what they want, and they will buy, and that is the whole idea behind any product for sale to the masses.
I even admit that I reeally liked the PT Cruiser when they came out, and in the end I bought one for my wife because she liked them even more than me.

It does not bother me at all to see alot of them on the road, as a matter of fact I enjoy it.

And a little off the main subject,
At one time I not only had my 70 GTO, but also a 1960 Metropolitan Conv.
When i drove the Goat only car people took notice of it, But when i drove the Met, EVERYBODY noticed it, and had some comment.
the GTO was 10 times the car the met was, but that had no bearing on the "stare factor"


I do get to ramble, and i apologize for that

thanks again for the response
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Hi Larry,
I forgot to mention, I was watching Speed channel( American Muscle Car Marathon tomorrow) and was surprised to see them run the Commercial with the GP, the Bonnevile, and the 04 GTO "spinning" into the garage

maybe too late, but they are trying, and have not seen one Ford commercial for the Stang, except a bunch of ads in Car Magazines

Happy Thanksgiving
 

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Well there you go.

They run a commercial on the ONE channel that everyone that watches already knows about the car! [BTW I love that commercial almost as much as the one where the car sits out a green light... both I downloaded from Pontiac, never saw "on the air"]

I think this is a great car, but there needs to be a balance between "everybody has one" and "not enough sales to continue building 'em" I am worried the sales are too near the "not enough" side.

---Larry
 

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I had to throw in my .02 here too. I agree with you that it seems confusing when people say it is very stealthy and yet get stared at all the time. But it's the truth. I don't have an explanation for that... it's rather strange. I, for one, bought the car specifically because it is stealthy. I'm not a flashy person and don't normally like to stand out in a crowd. When looking to trade in my '03 Grand Am, I narrowed my choices down to 3 cars. The GTO, the RX8 and the Bonneville SEi. In the end, the RX8 was too flashy for me and though supposedly very quick, doesn't have the power of the goat. The Bonneville was too 'family-like' (even though I have 3 kids), and a little more expensive than I really wanted. I was hooked on the goat the first time the salesman started it up for me. It literally rocked back and forth at idle. And the stealthiness sold me on it. It seemed perfect for me cuz I could 'show off' when I wanted to, and still fly under the radar when I wanted to. What I didn't expect, and was uncomfortable with for the first month or so, is precisely the attention it gets at stop lights or when I pull into a gas station. At stop lights, it's really amusing to watch people's reactions. They literally do double takes. The first look seems to be one of those 'who's pulling up next to me looks' and then after a brief look away, you can almost hear neck bones popping as they whip back around to see just what the heck it is. From then until the light turns green it's a flat-out stare. And pulling up behind someone is funny too. They do everything short of turning completely around in the seat... bouncing from inside mirror to outside mirror trying to get a better. Very nerve wracking for someone who's not comfortable being in the lime-light... but I got used to it. My 17yr old son asks me all the time how I ever got used to it. I even got my windows tinted because of it. And I can't tell you the number of times I've pulled in and parked somewhere, only to have someone come over to get a closer look and ended up crawling inside and outside the car, under the hood and underneath, and then walk away saying Wow... beautiful, while shaking their head.
I'll admit the new 'stangs are very pretty and very eyecatching. But as others have stated, they will be a dime-a-dozen. That's fine for someone who doesn't mind and I have nothing against that. I never knew what it was like to have a one of a kind car before my GTO so I had no way of knowing how it felt to not 'see yourself' at every street corner. I live in Charlotte, NC...population almost a million... and I have not seen one other GTO in the area. I've been to Atlanta several times in it and did not see another also. Some would say that's bad... it means the car is not selling. Maybe that should bother me but it doesn't. I've got mine. :)
As far as getting offensive when someone trashes the car, I think it's more a reaction to someone coming here... to a forum specifically for goat LOVERS... to do nothing but trash the car. I'm sure there are lots of folks who don't care for it and I'm aware of that when driving down the road. I'm sure there are people out there that see it go by and think "ewww...my God that car's ugly". That's life. But if someone goes out of their way to register on this site just to trash the car... that's doing nothing but antagonizing. And it's incredibly immature. I don't care for Mustangs but I don't go to their sites just to trash them. I absolutely abhor the little 'mad hornet' sounding rice burners, but I prefer to let my car take care of them at stoplights. :cool It's especially satisfying to play with them for a few minutes when the light turns green, knowing I've still got plenty of pedal, and then stomping on it when they're about wound out. I can just about hear their jaw hitting the floorboard as I chalk another one up to 'stealthiness'.
And yes... in my own opinion... it does look rather like a cavalier on steroids. But I'm okay with that. Stealth when I want it, power when I need it. Too cool.
In the end it comes down to what someone likes... just like everything else. :cheers
 

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By the way Larry M... speaking of commercials... my 17yr old has an idea for one that just cracks me up. It's animated (not cartoonish). It's night time. Two generic ricers (think 'The Fast and the Furious) are sitting at a red light, gunning their engines at one another. Off in the distance you hear a deep growl from a very fast moving car that causes the ricers to quit gunning for a moment. All of a sudden a GTO comes into the picture from behind and with animated 'ram horns', boots the ricer on the left completely out of the picture, takes its place at the light and revs it's engine at the one remaining. Following a very brief, but very 'pregnant' pause, the remaining ricer turns on its right turn signal, very slowly turns right and slinks away. When he first told me about this, I thought he meant he'd seen the commercial on tv and I was all excited about seeing it... until he explained that it was just an idea. Darn. I think he ought to call someone at GM... it cracked me up. :)
 

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GTO vs Mustang

As probably one of the newest 04 GTO owners, I admit I had my new car whittled down to either an 05 Mustang or an 05 GTO. I couldnt wait any longer and went with the 04 GTO (great deals to be had for all).

I look forward to being one of the few GTO owners driving around my town, surrounded by a "just another mustang."

As a yound man I owned 3 stangs and 1 goat over time, but my GTO is always a fond memory. I can say for me that I like the uniqueness of the car.

350hp stock dont hurt either! ;)
 

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Maybe I'm in the minority, but I think it's great to have a car that there are so few of. I know what my goat will do performance wise, but everyone else wants to know. I rarely see another GTO on the street and I travel a lot. I have said before in this forum that I often find people by my car when I come out of stores with questions to ask about the car, and I have even came out to find people on the ground looking under the car at the rear suspension. I had a 68 stang as a kid and loved it. Granted Ford will sell these cars like crazy. I believe they claim the capability of producing 175-200 thousand of them a year. I guess everbody will have one. Well not me. I like going my own way. Oh yeah, I did add a Banchee ram air hood to my goat. Not that the car didn't look great the way it was, just made it more my car.
 

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As I posted on another thread, do you think anyone can tell at a glance which BMW you are driving? NO!! They only know it's a BMW. As to old style GTO looks, I too watched the muscle car series on SPEED. I thought about all the negitive comments of the new GTO not looking like the OLD ( Thankfully ). I fail to see how a "new retro GTO" could include the old school look with a 6 foot rear overhang behind the rear wheels.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I thought about all the negitive comments of the new GTO not looking like the OLD ( Thankfully ). I fail to see how a "new retro GTO" could include the old school look with a 6 foot rear overhang behind the rear wheels.



so you dont like the old GTO's look ?

and the overhang behind the rear wheels is only 5' 10", so there :cheers
 

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I didn't say I didn't like the old GOAT. I did and I do. But the style of the old GTO would not fly today. The point of my post is the new GTO has a family resemblence, just as all new BMW's have the same "face". The GTO has been "gone" for many years. When it re-appeared there is no way it's old style could have "morphed" into a modern shape. And many complained. I don't hear the same complaints about the BMW ( for instance ) yet they all look alike. I think that is because THEY ARE ALL BMW's. With the GTO many would like to forget the rest of the family of PONTIACs and have the GTO stand alone. Yet it is a Pontiac and looks like it's cousins. Personally, I like the shape of the GTO ( but then again I drove alot of OPELS and like the look). I also removed the Screaming Chicken decal from every TA I use to own. The TA wheel flares and hoodscoops (the non-functional ones anyway ) were to "BOY RACER" for my tastes. After looking at the Speed channels Muscle car series. The first GTO's had small hoodscoops, redline tires, better suspension ( any change in those days had to be in a positive direction ) and little else excect a great engine, to differentiate them from "common" the Tepest. Those little GTO letters on the from back and sides where it's idenity. As the years went by even the flamboyant "JUDGE" was mostly a tape job, with very few additional body mods. ( hoodscoops and spoiler, and Big tires ). Sounds pretty close to the present GTO to me. ( You can keep the tape job !!! nothing more tasteless than tape on a clean body vehicle )
Having just driven a WRX STi it's also safe to say you can go TOO FAR with hoodscoops and spoilers also. The Subbie "nabisco box scoop" and Wright bros. spoiler may look great to the "Xand Y" generation, but not to the lads and gals that grew up with the old GTO's. Remeber the Olds 442 or W30 442?- clean car big tires and engine. ( The original not the later Hurst/Olds ) I liked the original Muscle cars, big engines and tires, clean lines.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
GTOTOO

you make some very good points. It is true, in the old days all Pontiacs had that same look, you could always see the stacked headlights and split grille and know it was a poncho.

Same as with todays cars

I am sorry to admit that I like the "factory" huge hood scoops, spoilers and stripes on muscle cars. Did you ever see a 1969 Hurst Olds?? that is my all time favorite car, and hopefully my kids will enjoy mine when I am gone, cause I aint never gonna sell it
 
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